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Moving forward with Composr

ocPortal has been relaunched as Composr CMS, which is now in beta. ocPortal 9 will be superseded by Composr 10.

Head over to compo.sr for our new site, and to our migration roadmap. Existing ocPortal member accounts have been mirrored.


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Posted
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#25104 (In Topic #5930)
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Community saint

What happened to adding an icon to the style page for exports?
I was expecting an icon but its not there. It does say how to do it though. Why go 3 steps if I can go one step to get done what I want.
 

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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Posted
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#25106
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It's a coding guideline of ours to not repeat things throughout the system, because that results in a system that people don't properly understand. In other words, if we linked to addons from styles, it's serve as a barrier to stop people properly understanding what addons themselves do – they'd learn how to use a shortcut, instead of learning what addons are and how to reach them.
This might sound silly in this single case. But when we design ocPortal, we have to develop rules and apply them consistently. If we didn't have this rule, there'd be hundreds of extra links in the system, and it'd be hard to create a proper mental image of how to do complex things, because the flow through the system wouldn't match how the system itself worked.


Become a fan of ocPortal on Facebook or add me as a friend. Add me on on Twitter.
Was I helpful?
  • If not, please let us know how we can do better (please try and propose any bigger ideas in such a way that they are fundable and scalable).
  • If so, please let others know about ocPortal whenever you see the opportunity.
  • If my reply is too Vulcan or expressed too much in business-strategy terms, and not particularly personal, I apologise. As a company & project maintainer, time is very limited to me, so usually when I write a reply I try and make it generic advice to all readers. I'm also naturally a joined-up thinker, so I always express my thoughts in combined business and technical terms. I recognise not everyone likes that, don't let my Vulcan-thinking stop you enjoying ocPortal on fun personal projects.
  • If my response can inspire a community tutorial, that's a great way of giving back to the project as a user.
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Posted
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#25110
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Community saint

 Ok well I am not happy about it.
To me its a flow so I am going to make an add on for the add ons.

ANd I do not want a short cut I want the feature there.
 


Last edit: by amichan

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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Posted
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#25111
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Community saint

 This will make a lot of work for me but I am going to do it. I will just have to open up every php file and search for both "Themes are transferred between software installations as addons. Therefore if you would like to import or export a theme, choose the 'Addons' icon, under the 'Setup' section of the Admin Zone."
And "Export theme".

This is what I want and was expecting.





Last edit: by amichan

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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Posted
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#25112
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Community saint

  

Chris Graham said

It's a coding guideline of ours to not repeat things throughout the system, because that results in a system that people don't properly understand. In other words, if we linked to addons from styles, it's serve as a barrier to stop people properly understanding what addons themselves do - they'd learn how to use a shortcut, instead of learning what addons are and how to reach them.
This might sound silly in this single case. But when we design ocPortal, we have to develop rules and apply them consistently. If we didn't have this rule, there'd be hundreds of extra links in the system, and it'd be hard to create a proper mental image of how to do complex things, because the flow through the system wouldn't match how the system itself worked.
  I do not properly understand it any way. Its not good to PO your customers either.
Also in that you sound like etomite who are so paranoid of making a portal that they made it harder the heck to us or imposible to use for some things.
Please do not let yours get that bad.
Will it really hurt to move the theme export and import to the themes section?


Last edit: by amichan

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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Posted
Rating:
#25146
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Well-settled

Deep breaths Ami, deep breaths…

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Posted
Rating:
#25158
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Community saint

I have calmed down, I am just going to do it myself.
I will say my expectations of version 4 went down by a lot.
To give you an idea I put version 4 before this on a pedistol and after this I took it off and distroyed the pedistol.

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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Posted
Rating:
#25162
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Well-settled

Well look on the bright side, the very fact ths script is so weird means there's a demand for your oc support website :)

Ironically one of the reasons I'll probably be buying it is because I like the high barrier for any of my competitors. Any idiot can throw up a forum but configuring OC takes time, patience and a willingness to ask 'daft' questions - which eliminates some of my competition ;)

I agree though that the layout is weird in the extreme, for example languages under styles instead of setup or configuration (what language shall I wear today?) but as you told me when I came here - the more you dig the more you find.

I feel that by far the biggest problem is that while making it very capable they've neglected the basics - making it very easy to create a unique site. Sure, a different OC Portal site is easy but a site that's not obviously OC Portal is not easy in the slightest.

It doesn't need a complete rebuild, what it needs is a serious usability overhaul - and some serious de-branding if they want people to actually buy it.

The main thing that keeps me coming back though is the speedy and helpful staff, and your good self. Without that I'd have deleted the thing long ago.

Right now I'm saving my pennies for a $170 program to help pirate-protect my own software, after that I've decided I will be buying this thing. Though unlike Invision it looks like I'm going to have to move my install to a different server, as this needs Apache before search engines can read it.

Is it a major hassle to move an installation? I don't fancy going through all this setup again  O_o


D
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Posted
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#25163
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Community saint

I agree with every thing you just said.
Moving ocPortal is easy. 2 ways of doing it.
Run the back up tool that comes with ocPortal or
Just move the files using ftp, you will need to move the database too unless it will be using the same one.


Last edit: by amichan

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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Posted
Rating:
#25181
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Will it really hurt to move the theme export and import to the themes section?

We've designed the system to be flexible with how addons work. A theme addon is an addon just as much as a code addon is an addon. A code addon could contain a theme, or a theme could come with some extra code. It's not too hard to come up with some practical uses for that – but that's not the point, because it would actually be arrogant for ocProducts to make assumptions that limit what a user might want to achieve.
This illustrates my point – we have great considerations to make, whilst might not seem obvious to a non-developer, but are still very important. ocPortal could not work if we did not design this.

for example languages under styles instead of setup or configuration (what language shall I wear today?)

The primary usage of the language functionality is to actually change English to other English. This is stylistic. You could argue it is also setup, but you could argue anything in the Admin Zone is setup, and we have to make subdivisions, even though there are no perfect subdivisions.

I feel that by far the biggest problem is that while making it very capable they've neglected the basics - making it very easy to create a unique site.

Content Management Systems are renowned for complexity. This isn't a coincidence, or mass incompetance – it's because what we allow is inherently complex. We have to think out of the box and make very difficult and complex design decisions to avoid limiting the user unnecessarily. I do realise some things on face value seem wrong, but I firmly believe I have either put very strong arguments for the way we do things, or fixed things, or said that we will fix things at an appropriate point in our development schedule.

Imagine a product that replaces the role of an architect, to allow people to make unique buildings. I think this more 'grounded' example illustrates the problem – there are countless practical issues that need to be considered that mean there is no magic bullet to whip out solid and diverse architectural plans with ease.

as this needs Apache before search engines can read it.

That's a very large exaggeration.


Our position as developers and my position as a representative is extremely complex. We have to make very complex decisions on a daily basis – if ocPortal is hard to use, then ocPortal is unimaginably difficult to design and maintain. I have to defend our design decisions on everything, because I can't allow public slamming of our product to go unchallenged, but then I risk looking combatitive or arrogant. A lot of good feedback is given that we can act on, and some feedback is given that we can't act on because users see our product with their own personal tunnel vision. And as of the last few days, we're expected to do tackle anything within a couple of days, which isn't possible – Microsoft, with all their immense resources, average years between software releases, and people still enmasse complain about almost every aspect.


Become a fan of ocPortal on Facebook or add me as a friend. Add me on on Twitter.
Was I helpful?
  • If not, please let us know how we can do better (please try and propose any bigger ideas in such a way that they are fundable and scalable).
  • If so, please let others know about ocPortal whenever you see the opportunity.
  • If my reply is too Vulcan or expressed too much in business-strategy terms, and not particularly personal, I apologise. As a company & project maintainer, time is very limited to me, so usually when I write a reply I try and make it generic advice to all readers. I'm also naturally a joined-up thinker, so I always express my thoughts in combined business and technical terms. I recognise not everyone likes that, don't let my Vulcan-thinking stop you enjoying ocPortal on fun personal projects.
  • If my response can inspire a community tutorial, that's a great way of giving back to the project as a user.
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Posted
Rating:
#25187
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Community saint

well I will say I tested joomla today just to compare it to ocPortal and it comes with nothing and I could not find the admin cp. Well I did look to see what folder or file would take me to it and got to it but there was no link to it.
When I got there its harder to use then ocPortal by far.
So I am sorry I made such a fuss over this. If I did not care so much about ocPortal I would not have said any thing.

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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Posted
Rating:
#25189
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Fan in action

I'm glad you tried out something else Ami. Joomla is though kids play when compared to some of the "big" enterprise CMS systems out there like eZ and Typo3. ocPortal is really, really easy to use but yet offers really complex stuff that almost rivals some of the big enterprize CMS's. That I find quite a feat and I take my hat off for the development team for having managed to pull that off.  :thumbs:

"I love deadlines. I especially like the whooshing sound they make as they go flying by."
- Douglas Adams (1952 - 2001)
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Posted
Rating:
#25190
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Community saint

Actually I have tried hundreds already.
Thats even mentioned on my site. The only reason I tried joomla today was 1.5 was one I had not tried and is new.

Also Chris mentioned the content management being hard, thats not hard at all specially once you get the permissions down.
The part that is hard is finding where the different parts of the admin zone are at.

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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Posted
Rating:
#25317
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Well-settled

You say I over-stress the search engine thingy - but when I run a Google site crawler on my site it just about finds the index page.

Google avoids links with "id=" as it considers them temps.

You KNOW this as you've created a short-url system. But it doesn't work on my plain linux hosting thingy.


D.
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Posted
Rating:
#25346
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Have you renamed recommended.htaccess to just .htaccess? If that didn't work, try renaming plain.htaccess to .htaccess.

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Posted
Rating:
#25375
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Google will index more pages if it thinks your page is more important. The short-URLs will make Google more liable to 'dig deeper' but it is not a 'yes or no' situation. Many many many dynamic sites are indexed without path-based URLs.


Become a fan of ocPortal on Facebook or add me as a friend. Add me on on Twitter.
Was I helpful?
  • If not, please let us know how we can do better (please try and propose any bigger ideas in such a way that they are fundable and scalable).
  • If so, please let others know about ocPortal whenever you see the opportunity.
  • If my reply is too Vulcan or expressed too much in business-strategy terms, and not particularly personal, I apologise. As a company & project maintainer, time is very limited to me, so usually when I write a reply I try and make it generic advice to all readers. I'm also naturally a joined-up thinker, so I always express my thoughts in combined business and technical terms. I recognise not everyone likes that, don't let my Vulcan-thinking stop you enjoying ocPortal on fun personal projects.
  • If my response can inspire a community tutorial, that's a great way of giving back to the project as a user.
Back to the top
 
Posted
Rating:
#25386
Avatar

Well-settled

I'm not talking about googlebot but a google site mapper that replicates what googlebot sees.

I did the htaccess thingy, first time it threw errors, now it works.


D
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Posted
Rating:
#25387
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Community saint

I have seen that mapper thing. I thought it was for making a tree navagaion of your site so I as disapointed with it when it did not do that.

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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