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Wiki set-up

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Posted
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#102429 (In Topic #20072)
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Fan in training

All,

I've got ocPortal up and working well.  I trying to get the wiki set up, but am struggling.  I think I first have to create a child page (that will be the "topic" page)?  I do that, and I see the child when I click on the Wiki menu button, but no "Post" button is visible.  I've googled to try and see if I can find any wiki set-up instructions, but have failed.  Can anyone help me out with detailed step-by-step instructions?

TIA.

Diggy
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Posted
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#102430
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Is this for a regular user, or for admin?

If it's for a regular user, possibly the permissions aren't set right.

If it's for admin, that's very odd.


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  • If my reply is too Vulcan or expressed too much in business-strategy terms, and not particularly personal, I apologise. As a company & project maintainer, time is very limited to me, so usually when I write a reply I try and make it generic advice to all readers. I'm also naturally a joined-up thinker, so I always express my thoughts in combined business and technical terms. I recognise not everyone likes that, don't let my Vulcan-thinking stop you enjoying ocPortal on fun personal projects.
  • If my response can inspire a community tutorial, that's a great way of giving back to the project as a user.
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Posted
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#102431
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Honoured member

Hi Diggy, Does this help? Setup a Wiki in ocPortal | Arvixe Blog

Just Jarv
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Posted
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#102432
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Fan in training

Thanks to both of you for responding.

The portal (awesome, btw) is for use by our six-person help desk team.  I want to add a menu item on the home page main nav called "Wiki", which I hope takes our users there.  I have, infact, created that, but am not sure if I did it ptoperly.  Of course, it should take us to the wiki page, which is what seems to happen.  I created a "test" child page called "Tips & Tricks", which we all can get to.  However, neither the admin noir the team members see a Post button.  So, I guess I've done it wrong.  Team members are members of Super-Member and Regular groups.

If I need to wipe out what I've done, and sytart over, I have no problem with that.

Steven, I read the post in the URL, but couldn't quite follow it.

Your continued help and patience would be greatly appreciated.

Diggy
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Posted
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#102433
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Could you attach a screenshot? It might help us see something that is obvious to us; my guess is we're all assuming something here that isn't true, but I don't know what.


Become a fan of ocPortal on Facebook or add me as a friend. Add me on on Twitter.
Was I helpful?
  • If not, please let us know how we can do better (please try and propose any bigger ideas in such a way that they are fundable and scalable).
  • If so, please let others know about ocPortal whenever you see the opportunity.
  • If my reply is too Vulcan or expressed too much in business-strategy terms, and not particularly personal, I apologise. As a company & project maintainer, time is very limited to me, so usually when I write a reply I try and make it generic advice to all readers. I'm also naturally a joined-up thinker, so I always express my thoughts in combined business and technical terms. I recognise not everyone likes that, don't let my Vulcan-thinking stop you enjoying ocPortal on fun personal projects.
  • If my response can inspire a community tutorial, that's a great way of giving back to the project as a user.
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Posted
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#102455
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Well-settled

Hi!
I must confess I've been scratching my head a bit about one thing since reading Steven's Arvixe blog-post, where he writes:
Wiki+ is created in a tree structure which allows for easy navigation

and on since reading the Manage Wiki description text in the cms zone, which Steven's sentence reflects:
Wiki+ is a hierarchical database of pages and posts which is in many ways like a forum system, but presented in an encyclopaedic style, and designed to have a deep and extensible hierarchy. Wiki+ can also be configured to behave just like a wiki system, by linking pages purely by using hypertext links.


If that's the case, why are new wiki pages created as orphans outside of the tree hierarchy and have to be expressly added to the tree via the Wiki Tree Editor (assuming one has opted to use a tree-structure wiki system)?

I was under the impression that the reason for the initially orphaned status of pages is because they're saved as extended flat database records (as per MediaWiki and most other wiki systems), which collectively have no structural relatedness to each other. Seemingly confirming that, I'm unable to see any wiki page files anywhere under my domain home-directory, which suggests they are saved solely as database records.
The hierarchical structuring, I believe, is achieved purely by anchoring wiki-page links to a splurgh tree-generating framework!

I found this to be a source of initial confusion when I started using Wiki+, and for me, my above explanation suffices to clear it up.

Would Steven and Chris care to come back on this?


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Posted
Item has a rating of 5 (Liked by Chris Graham)  
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#102457
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Community saint

Chris, I got this man. Go enjoy a drink.

Hi RichT, mythus here. If you click on my signature link, you will see that I am a HUGE user of the Wiki+, though I still call it by its original name, CEDI.

Anyway, here's the rub down. The WIKI+ is more of a structured forum type deal than anything. Here's the low-down.

1. You make the page. This is your category so to speak.

2. You make the child pages that go with that page. You do this via the Wiki Tree Editor. In the tree editor, you type in a new page name and it will create that new page for you. You can also link to existing pages, and other things such as forum topics and catalogues.

Now the page itself is the main meat and potatoes of it all. You can set the permissions on the parent page that affect all of the child pages. You can use the page as your wiki page.

What is different is that you also have posts. You can have the page treat posts as them being all visible, giving it more of a structured forum look and feel. You can also set the page to treat posts as hidden, giving it a more Wiki look and feel.

The reason I like CEDI better than Wiki+ (CEDI was its previous name) was because it isn't and is a Wiki. It's not using the standard mediawiki syntax and structure, but it is a Centralized Encyclopedic Display of Information (see what I did there?)

Really, the books system of Drupal is closer to the CEDI/Wiki+ than MediaWiki. But ocPortal's Wiki+ has far more! You can also set up forms for the Wiki+ pages and such. It is extremely flexible.

On my site, I have it set so that members of certain groups can edit the tree to create pages and can edit pages. It is important that if you want to have it set up like a Wiki, to give the group tree editing and page editing permissions, and to give them submission for mid-level content permissions.

Does this help? I used to have an entry in the documentation here about it, but I'm not sure it's still there lol.

Legends of Nor'Ova: A site powered by ocPortal; home of the Legends of Nor'Ova tabletop RPG wiki and community.

Like ocPortal? Want to thank Chris and gang somehow? Then help out in the chat room! It really needs your help! Just open it in a tab everytime you open your web browser, and when you hear a "ding", check it out!

"Those who want help should first be willing to give help."
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Posted
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#102461
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Well-settled

Hi mythus!

Many thanks for your reply! I'm glad to say that I got comfortably to grips with everything you put after a short teething period (and a hotfix from Chris concerning the Wiki tree editor!). But I'm afraid I'm still puzzled by the specific matter of my post - not really a case of how to use the wiki system's interfaces and features, but of its underbelly's design and the programmatic methodology used.

Might you be able to fill me in about that somewhat, too? Would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks again,

Richard
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Posted
Item has a rating of 5 (Liked by Chris Graham)  
Rating:
#102462
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Community saint

Greetings!

I don't have a lot of time right now - the wife(tm) has us in spring cleaning mode. But I don't want to leave you hanging either.

The thing to understand here is that the Wiki+ wasn't created originally as a Wiki+. It was created long before such things as wikis and the like were popular. Despite the name change from CEDI to Wiki+, it still bears the same basic design it had before.

Namely, as in what I believe to be your question, dealing with pages.

With the Wiki+ you can use already created pages like it looks like you've been doing correct? That is one of the things you can do. As I'm sure you've already seen you can also create new pages simply by editing the tree, and you can link to the tree things that are not pages (wiki or comcode) such as catalogues, forum topics, etc…

The hiccup you seem to be experiencing (i could be wrong and applogize if I am) in your understanding of it all is that you are approaching it as a Wiki like Mediawiki and the like. That is understandable really with it being called a Wiki+ and why I was against the name change when it happened. CEDI really explains better what it is than Wiki+

So really, it has to be looked at differently.

Create new pages via tree…
Link to existing pages…
Make structured posts…

The CEDI system is simply that, a structured system of pages. It is a complex yet highly flexible extension of both the OCF Forum and the Comcode Pages. You could emulate some of it simply by making Comcode Pages and page links, but not all of it.

The CEDI also can act as various things, a Wiki-like information display and structured forums are simply the two main uses for it.

If that's the case, why are new wiki pages created as orphans outside of the tree hierarchy and have to be expressly added to the tree via the Wiki Tree Editor (assuming one has opted to use a tree-structure wiki system)?

New Wiki Pagtes shouldn't be orphans really, assuming you created them via the Wiki Tree editor. They should be linked to the page they are created for. So I am not really sure what you are talking about here.

If you created pages via the Comcode Pages, those aren't really Wiki Pages. However, they can be linked to the Wiki via the Tree. Also you can link to other Wiki Pages created elsewhere in the Wiki via the tree.

And the Wiki Pages are stored, like other things, in the database. They are linked to the translation table, which is a huge table.

Hope this helps. If not, I'll try to clarify what I can later. I got the wife standing over me, and you don't want to anger the wife!

Legends of Nor'Ova: A site powered by ocPortal; home of the Legends of Nor'Ova tabletop RPG wiki and community.

Like ocPortal? Want to thank Chris and gang somehow? Then help out in the chat room! It really needs your help! Just open it in a tab everytime you open your web browser, and when you hear a "ding", check it out!

"Those who want help should first be willing to give help."
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Posted
Item has a rating of 5 (Liked by mythus)  
Rating:
#102463
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The basic misunderstanding seems to hang on orphaned pages being perceived as a bad thing. It's fine to have pages not linked into the tree structure, if you're linking to them in the typical wiki-code style syntax ([[page name]]). Comcode has subsumed that part of wiki-code.
It's a choice you have. You can link in both ways, one way, or the other way.

EDIT: will add that to the tutorial.


Become a fan of ocPortal on Facebook or add me as a friend. Add me on on Twitter.
Was I helpful?
  • If not, please let us know how we can do better (please try and propose any bigger ideas in such a way that they are fundable and scalable).
  • If so, please let others know about ocPortal whenever you see the opportunity.
  • If my reply is too Vulcan or expressed too much in business-strategy terms, and not particularly personal, I apologise. As a company & project maintainer, time is very limited to me, so usually when I write a reply I try and make it generic advice to all readers. I'm also naturally a joined-up thinker, so I always express my thoughts in combined business and technical terms. I recognise not everyone likes that, don't let my Vulcan-thinking stop you enjoying ocPortal on fun personal projects.
  • If my response can inspire a community tutorial, that's a great way of giving back to the project as a user.
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Posted
Rating:
#102467
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Community saint

It's a mediawiki thing I think Chris. "Orphaned pages? Oh no!"

The Wiki+ (CEDI!!!) is so much more versitile than that. It takes an adjustment for those used to one idea and thinking it might be the same here. Kindof one of my reasons against the namechange IIRC :P.

Legends of Nor'Ova: A site powered by ocPortal; home of the Legends of Nor'Ova tabletop RPG wiki and community.

Like ocPortal? Want to thank Chris and gang somehow? Then help out in the chat room! It really needs your help! Just open it in a tab everytime you open your web browser, and when you hear a "ding", check it out!

"Those who want help should first be willing to give help."
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Posted
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#102621
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Well-settled

Hi mythus!

Must apologize for my conspicuous sudden disappearance - unavoidably before I could thank you for your last reply to me:$. I really appreciate your points and your effort and time on my behalf!

Glad to report that most of what you wrote already makes sense to me, after my initial period of getting to grips with the system. It's good to have all that confirmed. You'll be reassured to know that "orphaned pages" don't evoke any sort of knee-jerk reaction these days - to me they're a perfectly normal, accepted aspect of how CEDI works. No sweat!

One thing I haven't yet got round to finding out - namely, whether the option to use [[pagename]] wiki-links becomes forfeited by attaching pages to the wiki-tree. I hope not. They'd still be mighty useful for me within a tree-structured system - which I've opted for, not at all for the purpose of navigation, but simply as a convenient device for classifying my pages and keeping track of them at a glance. In all other respects I need CEDI to be wiki-like (using posts as equivalent to Wikipedia "Discuss" tabs). I don't actually need child pages displayed beneath articles, as all my articles have a "Related Pages" heading for links as standard, while additional inline hyperlinking is absolutely vital. Guess I'll be ascertaining that soon, but if you had any comments about that, I'd be really grateful for any!

It'd be great to take up your invitation to peruse your website's wiki - I did visit your site as a guest, but wasn't sure what level of membership I'd need to be registered as in order to access it. Could you spare another moment to fill me in about that?

Kind regards for now,

Richard.

P.S. I do hope these last few posts have helped Diggy and not seemed :offtopic: from his perspective. If you're there, Diggy, would be really great to learn how you're progressing!

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Posted
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#102622
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Community saint

Hi RichT!

I don't have a lot of time to go into your topic ATM, but I'll come back and read over and see what I can answer as soon as I can.

I just wanted to take the time to answer about the wiki on my site.

Guests can view all pages except the Advance Lore page. I have the wiki sections that are in use each linked to the Encyclopedia Nor'Ova menu.

Legends of Nor'Ova: A site powered by ocPortal; home of the Legends of Nor'Ova tabletop RPG wiki and community.

Like ocPortal? Want to thank Chris and gang somehow? Then help out in the chat room! It really needs your help! Just open it in a tab everytime you open your web browser, and when you hear a "ding", check it out!

"Those who want help should first be willing to give help."
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Posted
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#102623
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Well-settled

Many thanks for the info, Mythus!
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