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SMF-import, search error, version question

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Posted
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#66004 (In Topic #14127)
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SMF 1.1.12 import failed, searching this forum missed things, a stable version?

Hi There ,
[Solved]First I want to mention that starting a message is technical very difficult. The 'Title' goes ok as is the 'Description', but then there's no way to type something under 'Your message' as things are grayed out, until I got the wild idea to disable the WYSIWYG' editing. That did the trick. (Windows7, IE8 normal options, nothing fancy). [Solved thanks Chris :thumbs:]

I installed ocPortal 5.3 yesterday, with Installatron 3 minutes work, and imported SMF 1.1.12. All goes ok except the attachments that won't be pulled in giving an error. Watching the forum all topics are locked and the first screen shows the forum names OK but set the counting for all forums to 0 topics 0 posts and (No posts yet) while there are 160 topics and 1229 post placed what shows correctly in the counting part under that screen.
Question: Is there an option to recount to possible solve this problem?[Solved thanks Brain :thumbs: ]
Q: Is there an option to shufle the catagorys to other places as I have a certain way to show them to visitors?

Remark: Searching this forum for things like version descryption and SMF import give some posts to read but when I would go to the topic of that message there's no way I could klik on the bold headerline above the messages. Its just not clickable. The solution for me was to hit the post # number as that was clickable.

Question: What is the latest stable version from ocPortal that have no bugs anymore?
Q: What are the differences in options between version 5.3 and that other version? Some help would be a link to the descriptions but your search machine don't know what 4.3.2 is so there is (for me) no way I could read it for myself what the version options are. I try to find out if ocPortal is an option for me now I'm building our site newly. Looks good sofar :).

Thats it, thanks for the time and effort.

21-7-1955 - 24-10-2011 I hope she rest in peace and I hope to see you soon.  Puran
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Posted
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#66006
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Community saint

Hi Puran,

If you go to admin>tools>website cleanup tools you will find an option to recount forum posts and topics.

The latest stable version is 5.0.3
Download page

Hope that helps some.
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Posted
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#66008
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Honoured member

Brian Hay said

If you go to admin>tools>website cleanup tools you will find an option to recount forum posts and topics.
That does the trick, thanks!

Brian Hay said

The latest stable version is 5.0.3
I installed 5.3 but see in this forum some reported bugs that are not solved yet. I mean a version that has almost no unsolved bugs left.

( Sitelink)

Greetings Puran.

21-7-1955 - 24-10-2011 I hope she rest in peace and I hope to see you soon.  Puran
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Posted
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#66010
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Community saint

Rite on, glad it worked and thanks for the points!

From what I have seen a lot of problems that are reported are from user error and not bugs. As well quite often topics don't get marked as solved when actually they have been.

Myself I am using 5.1 beta and have had next to no problems, works great for me.

I am having a hard time resisting upgrading to 6 beta but don't want to jump the gun. I was the first to download it when it was released and am very impressed. I am sure I will be upgrading with confidence in the very near future.
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Posted
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#66027
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Hi,

The easiest way for me to assist on import issues is if you can email an SQL dump of the SMF DB to chris@ocportal.com. I can then try for myself.

Is there an option to shufle the catagorys to other places as I have a certain way to show them to visitors?

If you edit the forums from the Admin Zone, yes.


I am looking into your various issues now.

Regarding the latest stable version, it would be 5.0.2. I think 6.0.0 will be more stable when it is released in perhaps 2 weeks. We're trying to be disciplined in minimising the disruption between new releases so that we solve more bugs than we create, whilst also improving usability. The reason is that to most people usability issues are as bad as bugs so need fixing in a similar kind of way.

Regards,
Chris


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  • If so, please let others know about ocPortal whenever you see the opportunity.
  • If my reply is too Vulcan or expressed too much in business-strategy terms, and not particularly personal, I apologise. As a company & project maintainer, time is very limited to me, so usually when I write a reply I try and make it generic advice to all readers. I'm also naturally a joined-up thinker, so I always express my thoughts in combined business and technical terms. I recognise not everyone likes that, don't let my Vulcan-thinking stop you enjoying ocPortal on fun personal projects.
  • If my response can inspire a community tutorial, that's a great way of giving back to the project as a user.
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Posted
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#66049
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Hi,

This should fix both import problems.

Attachment
sources/hooks/modules/admin_import/smf.php
» Download: smf.php (41 Kb, 158 downloads so far)


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  • If not, please let us know how we can do better (please try and propose any bigger ideas in such a way that they are fundable and scalable).
  • If so, please let others know about ocPortal whenever you see the opportunity.
  • If my reply is too Vulcan or expressed too much in business-strategy terms, and not particularly personal, I apologise. As a company & project maintainer, time is very limited to me, so usually when I write a reply I try and make it generic advice to all readers. I'm also naturally a joined-up thinker, so I always express my thoughts in combined business and technical terms. I recognise not everyone likes that, don't let my Vulcan-thinking stop you enjoying ocPortal on fun personal projects.
  • If my response can inspire a community tutorial, that's a great way of giving back to the project as a user.
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Posted
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#66050
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WYSIWYG - hopefully now fixed, I think it may have been related to our server problems. I left a longer note about this in the v6 release comment topic as Jean also had trouble (ocPortal 6 beta1 released! - ocPortal).

Searching - thanks, improved usability here now.


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Was I helpful?
  • If not, please let us know how we can do better (please try and propose any bigger ideas in such a way that they are fundable and scalable).
  • If so, please let others know about ocPortal whenever you see the opportunity.
  • If my reply is too Vulcan or expressed too much in business-strategy terms, and not particularly personal, I apologise. As a company & project maintainer, time is very limited to me, so usually when I write a reply I try and make it generic advice to all readers. I'm also naturally a joined-up thinker, so I always express my thoughts in combined business and technical terms. I recognise not everyone likes that, don't let my Vulcan-thinking stop you enjoying ocPortal on fun personal projects.
  • If my response can inspire a community tutorial, that's a great way of giving back to the project as a user.
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Posted
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#66057
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Honoured member

Thank you very much. In return I did somework at Launchpad  :offtopic: .

I had first the tought to install 4.3.2. Now I installed 5.0.3 but I found more problems: I miss the "Copyright ocProducts Ltd, 2011 " message under at the screen. Is that not the meaning to put it there? I realy did nothing to remove it. It is just not there, sorry. Link: ( site).

Afther uninstall addons I got a screen full of db-errors about missing just that what I removed. I put it back so now the errors are gone, but I got the feeling ocPortal is unstable now and show very seldom some db-errors but only when I want to visit the Admin-zone. I think I clean everything out and start over, using your patch as wel. Installing ocPortal is at the most 5 minutes work for me with installatron.

Q: Are the themes for version 6.x different from version 5.x? Should it be wise to wait till version 6.x got stable or does that take more then a few weeks?

Thanks so far, Puran.

21-7-1955 - 24-10-2011 I hope she rest in peace and I hope to see you soon.  Puran
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Posted
Rating:
#66059
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Possibly the copyright option is set to blank.

In v5 there were some bugs when addons are removed. v6 is actually much better at this.
I totally appreciate what you're saying regarding slowing things down to get things proved stable. However the demand to increase more user-friendliness has been huge because it is a barrier for a lot of people, and we don't have enough resources to apply bug fixes in parallel to multiple versions. So we've treated usability issues like bugs and controlled risk across new major versions by being careful to not change things that would break compatibility much. I think now we will be able to slow things down.

I can't say when v6 will be stable for sure. It did get a lot of testing because a lot of the work in it was ensuring things worked with millions of entries which meant using it a lot. Most of the reported bugs have been in the upgrade process or the main new features (breadcrumb control, new setup wizard). I suspect beta2 (or may be it will be called rc1) will be very stable.

As far as I know all v5 addons and themes should work unmodified in v6.


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  • If so, please let others know about ocPortal whenever you see the opportunity.
  • If my reply is too Vulcan or expressed too much in business-strategy terms, and not particularly personal, I apologise. As a company & project maintainer, time is very limited to me, so usually when I write a reply I try and make it generic advice to all readers. I'm also naturally a joined-up thinker, so I always express my thoughts in combined business and technical terms. I recognise not everyone likes that, don't let my Vulcan-thinking stop you enjoying ocPortal on fun personal projects.
  • If my response can inspire a community tutorial, that's a great way of giving back to the project as a user.
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Posted
Rating:
#66061
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Community saint

Greetings,

I can report that my v5 theme works perfectly in v6.

Also I had found in my uses that 5beta1 was actually more stable than 5.0.3.

Your results may vary however.

Legends of Nor'Ova: A site powered by ocPortal; home of the Legends of Nor'Ova tabletop RPG wiki and community.

Like ocPortal? Want to thank Chris and gang somehow? Then help out in the chat room! It really needs your help! Just open it in a tab everytime you open your web browser, and when you hear a "ding", check it out!

"Those who want help should first be willing to give help."
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Posted
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#66067
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Honoured member

mythus said

I can report that my v5 theme works perfectly in v6.

Also I had found in my uses that 5beta1 was actually more stable than 5.0.3.
Thanks for your remarks. They are really helpfull for me.

Greetings Puran.

21-7-1955 - 24-10-2011 I hope she rest in peace and I hope to see you soon.  Puran
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Posted
Rating:
#66083
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(I'm replying to a whisper here publicly as I think this may be interesting to people)

Hi Puran,

I don't find thought provoking replies annoying at all, I find them positive!

We are in control of the Installatron release, I can actually update it whenever I like. So when v6 is seen to be stable I will do that.
Also I'll upload to Launchpad. I can move over all translated strings onto v6 on there so that nothing is lost.

Regarding translation leadership, I agree. About 2 years ago we emailed everyone who had talked about doing translations but nobody really replied. So it's difficult for us because if we go to the effort of setting up a translation leader and helping them organise, it has a tendency not to go anywhere when people disappear, so it is wasted effort from us. It's this kind of thing that make us concentrate on usability perhaps more than stability, because I think people just give up on the complexity of it. Even if we make things easier than have nothing to do with translations it still frees up people's time to concentrate on the remaining hard tasks. One of the improvements in v6 is directly to do with translations.

I think one part of the problem is that it's a big world, and someone might come along interested in doing a French translation, then someone German, then someone Spanish, but there's never 5 people interested in German at the same time, so people get isolated/lonely/bored/ungratified.

Because it's not an area we can lead in or put much resources, we've tried to decentralise things, so that people are empowered and can work together:
  • On the community documentation people can give tips.
  • On the forum people can come together and discuss plans.
  • In the addon directory people can release finished packs.
  • On Launchpad people can work together.
The problem is that  there still has to be very strong interest and a lot of time investment to make it work, and I don't know how to promote that except from increasing ocPortal adoption generally. Really each language needs a strong leader to come along with a plan of how they can make ocPortal strong in their particular country; they can then come to me and tell me specifically what support they need (e.g. pinning or closing specific forum topics, putting them in a specific usergroup, or fixing specific issues with the documentation), but hopefully also provide a lot of time investment and leadership to make it actually happen. It's almost always the case in life that most people's plans exceed their patience, so we can't put a lot of time in each time someone has a plan unless we see a lot of momentum coming along with it. We also can't try and manage a big set of multiple translations at once, because unless there is real work going with a team of translators ready to work it looks to people like we are "rearranging deck chairs" (rearrange the deck chairs on the Titanic - Wiktionary)

All the details of the releases can be found in our news archive:
News archive - ocPortal
I think one part of the usability of our own site is simply that it's in English which must make it hard for many people who aren't native-English to understand easily. I can just about make my way around French or German sites because I have some limited knowledge of these languages, but it's just much more difficult. I've never heard people confirm this but I think it's probably true.
People have talked about making their own native-language equivalents to ocPortal.com which we support, but that is something people tend to find they don't have time for. As a simple solution we have put Google Translate in our site footer, but obviously it's not perfect.

I suspect this long post will trigger some further positive discussion. My aim is to spur on some of the leadership I've mentioned here and help people see where ocProducts can give basic help and infrastructure assistance and where people need to push things forward themselves.

The absolute ideal situation would be if leaders come out for each language and then find/recruit enough people from the same country willing to give some time in order to bring ocPortal to their country.


Become a fan of ocPortal on Facebook or add me as a friend. Add me on on Twitter.
Was I helpful?
  • If not, please let us know how we can do better (please try and propose any bigger ideas in such a way that they are fundable and scalable).
  • If so, please let others know about ocPortal whenever you see the opportunity.
  • If my reply is too Vulcan or expressed too much in business-strategy terms, and not particularly personal, I apologise. As a company & project maintainer, time is very limited to me, so usually when I write a reply I try and make it generic advice to all readers. I'm also naturally a joined-up thinker, so I always express my thoughts in combined business and technical terms. I recognise not everyone likes that, don't let my Vulcan-thinking stop you enjoying ocPortal on fun personal projects.
  • If my response can inspire a community tutorial, that's a great way of giving back to the project as a user.
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Posted
Rating:
#66089
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Community saint

Greetings,

I happen to think that these issues are issues that any CMS project would experience with a smaller community, meaning that it takes a large community to really answer all the needs people have for a CMS.. or a very large budget.

It's a catch-22 type of situation really. So many who are new to working with CMS'es get their start with the likes of Joomla and other extremely simple CMS offerings. When they soon realize that they don't like the way, for example, Joomla does something, they begin to look around, first finding a CMS that will offer them everything they need out-of-the-box. Such kind of searching typically leads them right here. ocPortal, being vastly different than Joomla, with so many options and features to dig through quickly intimidates the casual web-builder.

So, ocProducts, which has a  smaller development staff than Joomla, and not really any developers amongst the community who can submit add-ons and the like to deal with usability, must focus on usability to attract new users. Not having enough developers, budget, and/or community developers/third party developers, means that if ocProducts focuses more on the usability aspect, stability and other aspects are likely to take a hit.

If ocProducts focused on stability, they would attract some users, sure, but not many users due to perceived usability issues.

If they focused on usability, they could attract more users, and the product should remain relatively stable, however only within the confines of what they were using to build and test on (their browsers and operating systems of choice and their host configurations), meaning that users outside of those configurations could likely experience stability issues. That could cause those users to not adopt the software, though I doubt it would cause current dedicated users with untested situations to leave.

It is really quite a pain, ocPortal simply needs a larger, more active community full of themers, coders, and testers, to make a good, solid, and user-friendly release… but it seems to be increasingly hard to get such a community without having a good, solid, stable, user-friendly release.

I myself cannot code. Oh I so wish I could, I have several ideas that I would like to see as add-ons for ocPortal (not core). Instead, I do what I can to support ocPortal in other ways, by 1.) posting in the forums when I can.
2.)releasing a theme once in a while
3.) using/testing the latest beta offerings and reporting back any issues that I find
4.) making any relevant suggestions regarding the core product as I can.

Being only a native english speaker, I can't comment on the language issues. I had always assumed that there wasn't an issue with languages in ocPortal. Knowing that there is a lack of language translations, I wish I could translate it.. but again, I only know english. I suspect that a majority of ocPortal users are english speaking as well…

As a side note, I am often curious about some of the stability issues I hear about. For example, I remember replying to a comment in opensourcecms.com regarding ocPortal as unstable. I hadn't had any real stability issues, except the catalogue issue in 5beta1(that was a host server error, not really an ocPortal error), and installation issues with 6beta1. On the flip side I have seen tons of improvements, such as the cross-browser supported WYSIWYG editor (before the 5.1 beta, the WYSIWYG editor only worked in select browsers, namely firefox and IE). Oh and the whole slowed down transitions/fancy code editor thing, that got resolved.

I have also found ocPortal to be relatively easy to use to do most things. Sure doing the more complex things, like virtual rooting and tempcode edits require lots off research and practice, but isn't that the case with anything new? Instead the only issues I had at the beginning wasn't ocPortal being to hard, it was simply getting used to the admin zone and figuring out how everything worked… something that no usability enhancement can really replace or improve upon. Whenever using something new, you have to get used to it, you can't expect to already completely know and understand it. The only things that could really be done to make it more simplified IMHO, I had commented upon with a mock-up to illustrate it (regarding getting rid of extra skins by putting the add buttons in with the edit screens).

On the other hand I always got aggravated with Joomla, and Drupal was something I cold never fully figure out, always kept getting issues with it when trying to make a site.

Anyways, I think I rambled on long enough yes? l

Legends of Nor'Ova: A site powered by ocPortal; home of the Legends of Nor'Ova tabletop RPG wiki and community.

Like ocPortal? Want to thank Chris and gang somehow? Then help out in the chat room! It really needs your help! Just open it in a tab everytime you open your web browser, and when you hear a "ding", check it out!

"Those who want help should first be willing to give help."
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Posted
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#66113
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Community saint

I agree that issues like translation are frustrating, since it's clearly an important area to be strong in and yet I am absolutely useless with languages. The only way I can think this could be improved without having the large, diverse community mythus mentioned is to reduce ocPortal's "footprint", ie. combining overlapping definitions, but there's only so far this can be taken. Also the image-based buttons are probably a bit of a hurdle, both to themers (as I found when making my Oxygen theme) and translators (since there's only so much control you can have over auto-generated images). The fancy CSS buttons help here, but haven't been rolled out universally yet.

In terms of usability, this is something that can always be improved, especially in the admin zone which takes a while to find your way around. This is a problem that requires good ideas, rather than the brute-force required for translations (and theming).

To mythus, I imaging that not being a programmer probably gives you the same frustration that I get from feeling helpless when it comes to translations. I will say that, for addons which aren't ocPortal-specific then the miniblocks and minimodules can be pretty easy to make. For example, if a Web site gives out some "embed this" code then it can be turned into an addon without much more than copy-pasting it into a new miniblock. Such simple addons are another brute-force thing I think; they just require that someone capable cares enough to put in the time.
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Posted
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#66127
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Community saint

ChrisW said

… not being a programmer probably gives you the same frustration that I get from feeling helpless when it comes to translations. I will say that, for addons which aren't ocPortal-specific then the miniblocks and minimodules can be pretty easy to make.

Some good points raised in the thread, but for me, a chimp-coder' (monkey-see, monkey-do in case somebody didn't get the oblique reference) an example of HOW would be invaluable for all future attempts.

I've often wished I could construct a miniblock or minimodule, but I've always fallen at the first hurdle, which is invariably opening up an existing mini-whatever and not understanding what I need to do.

So you see, it's OK to recommend, but unless somebody takes the lead and shows an example - with support notes - people like me who are willing, are just not capable!

 :thumbs:

Take my advice. I'm not using it!

View my working ocPortal site (version 9.x.x) at Anglo-Indian Portal
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Posted
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#66137
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Community saint

Fletch said

Some good points raised in the thread, but for me, a chimp-coder' (monkey-see, monkey-do in case somebody didn't get the oblique reference) an example of HOW would be invaluable for all future attempts.

I've often wished I could construct a miniblock or minimodule, but I've always fallen at the first hurdle, which is invariably opening up an existing mini-whatever and not understanding what I need to do.

So you see, it's OK to recommend, but unless somebody takes the lead and shows an example - with support notes - people like me who are willing, are just not capable!

Understood :) I'll see if I can throw something together for the community documentation
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Posted
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#66144
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Honoured member

Chris Graham said

(I'm replying to a whisper here publicly as I think this may be interesting to people)
I left the choice to you as I found out in life that not everybody can understand my interpretation of English (thats my grammer and the spelling, the rest seems ok) and sometimes they see it as critics and very much people cant cope with critics as they think they are attacked. I'm happy to find out that the bunch of people here are from the wise sort.

Chris Graham said

We are in control of the Installatron release, I can actually update it whenever I like. So when v6 is seen to be stable I will do that.
Also I'll upload to Launchpad. I can move over all translated strings onto v6 on there so that nothing is lost.
I ment to point to the fact that you are working on two versions now, while you mention missing the time for that, so I launched the tought to concentrate to one version first.

Chris Graham said

Regarding translation leadership, I agree. About 2 years ago we emailed everyone who had talked about doing translations but nobody really replied. So it's difficult for us because if we go to the effort of setting up a translation leader and helping them organise, it has a tendency not to go anywhere when people disappear, so it is wasted effort from us.
I think it was not all wasted energy. I must have missed that message. I was gone for some time by personal circumstances (my wife is dying and only God knows when she goes) and so I couldn't understand things like I would. Thats much better now, while the situation is still time and energy consuming, I find it a relief to work on this kind of things here.
I think there is something learned here that is usefull. Beside that, if I look around I can see that the world seems to gone crazy sometimes as things cost more time to realise and some translations take far more time then in the past (specially Dutch  ;) ).
If I look around I think people goes for the example they see (I want that too feeling) and start finding out how to get it and let it work the way they want. In there own language are things better to explain and understand so that helps. If they succeed they want to belong to the group that served the help to get their
site where they want it.
Most people want the site they wish in their language, enough (quick) help by their
questions, ready templates and integrations, in a safe environment, if possible for nothing and while they want something special they also want something everybody has as that is accepted and somehow is a kind of garanty that their site will be accepted.

mythus said

So many who are new to working with CMS'es get their start with the likes of Joomla and other extremely simple CMS offerings. When they soon realize that they don't like the way, for example, Joomla does something, they begin to look around, first finding a CMS that will offer them everything they need out-of-the-box. Such kind of searching typically leads them right here. ocPortal, being vastly different than Joomla, with so many options and features to dig through quickly intimidates the casual web-builder.
So why not rearange the choices in the first place by making things easyer to choose from packets specially made for a certain use with enough templates and a solit installer, so that there are as little as possible choises left within a reasonable instant solution. Then one can compare the ocPortal solutions against Joomla and I think ocP could win on safety, clearness and stabillity. If things are made possible it could happen.

Like Fletch and Chris W are doing: get a group together (a little one at first) users and ocP people and start making things people need to work with.  Lets start with say 4 or 5 people doing little things, then it can grow to something. Have notthing doesn't grow anything. If the ocP-usergroup (or whatever you call it) send out the feeling and can show things it could be easyer to get more people do so. Joomla has so much people because almost everybody wants to belong to a club that has many members so there is a use for there makings by many people. Feels good.

Greetings Puran

21-7-1955 - 24-10-2011 I hope she rest in peace and I hope to see you soon.  Puran
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Posted
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#66147
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Community saint

Darn it, I was almost done with this huge epic multi-paragraph post… then Firefox decided to quit instantly and lost it all.

Gotta take a breather, and maybe I'll try to do it again.

Legends of Nor'Ova: A site powered by ocPortal; home of the Legends of Nor'Ova tabletop RPG wiki and community.

Like ocPortal? Want to thank Chris and gang somehow? Then help out in the chat room! It really needs your help! Just open it in a tab everytime you open your web browser, and when you hear a "ding", check it out!

"Those who want help should first be willing to give help."
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Posted
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#66148
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It should have auto-saved, if you weren't using the quick reply. If you go back it should ask you if you want it back.


Become a fan of ocPortal on Facebook or add me as a friend. Add me on on Twitter.
Was I helpful?
  • If not, please let us know how we can do better (please try and propose any bigger ideas in such a way that they are fundable and scalable).
  • If so, please let others know about ocPortal whenever you see the opportunity.
  • If my reply is too Vulcan or expressed too much in business-strategy terms, and not particularly personal, I apologise. As a company & project maintainer, time is very limited to me, so usually when I write a reply I try and make it generic advice to all readers. I'm also naturally a joined-up thinker, so I always express my thoughts in combined business and technical terms. I recognise not everyone likes that, don't let my Vulcan-thinking stop you enjoying ocPortal on fun personal projects.
  • If my response can inspire a community tutorial, that's a great way of giving back to the project as a user.
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Posted
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#66149
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Community saint

Yeah I used quick reply. I wasn't meaning to write a long post lol but it had become quite lengthy.

Legends of Nor'Ova: A site powered by ocPortal; home of the Legends of Nor'Ova tabletop RPG wiki and community.

Like ocPortal? Want to thank Chris and gang somehow? Then help out in the chat room! It really needs your help! Just open it in a tab everytime you open your web browser, and when you hear a "ding", check it out!

"Those who want help should first be willing to give help."
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