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new quote bug I think

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Posted
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#31077 (In Topic #7102)
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Community saint

I noticed today on 3.1.5 that on the forum news when it is displayed if the original post has the text in the quote bbcode it does not show up in those quote bbcode in the forum news block.





I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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Posted
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#31079
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In order for it to display like Invision Board displays it, it's necessary to add some more CSS to ocPortal. Invision Board stores all it's posts in HTML format, which is fine, except the CSS styles of IPB are not in ocPortal, so it won't be styled in the same way as IPB would style it.
I'll add this to the 'Nuances of forum integration' tutorial.


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  • If not, please let us know how we can do better (please try and propose any bigger ideas in such a way that they are fundable and scalable).
  • If so, please let others know about ocPortal whenever you see the opportunity.
  • If my reply is too Vulcan or expressed too much in business-strategy terms, and not particularly personal, I apologise. As a company & project maintainer, time is very limited to me, so usually when I write a reply I try and make it generic advice to all readers. I'm also naturally a joined-up thinker, so I always express my thoughts in combined business and technical terms. I recognise not everyone likes that, don't let my Vulcan-thinking stop you enjoying ocPortal on fun personal projects.
  • If my response can inspire a community tutorial, that's a great way of giving back to the project as a user.
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Posted
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#31080
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Community saint

But I know ocPortal has the ability to use quotes, right?
If I have to install a copy of ocPortal with out using IPB and show you I will.

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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Posted
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#31081
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This is what I've written for the tutorial:
In order for it to perfectly display forum posts in the ocPortal 'forum news' block in the same way as IPB would display them, it's necessary to take some CSS from IPB and place it in the ocPortal global.css file. This particular applies to posts that contain quotes. Invision Board stores all it's posts in HTML format, which is fine, except the CSS styles of IPB are internal to IPB and thus not in ocPortal – the cause of this problem.
The particular styles that would need copying would depend on the skin that IPB was using. If you are experiencing this problem, look at the HTML ocPortal outputs and see what CSS classnames are being referenced – then copy over any styles that apply to these classnames.

By the time the post data is in the forum database, it is not specifically a quote anymore. It's already been converted into HTML, and tied into IPB's CSS files such that it is those CSS files that define the appearance of what it looks like. Usually you don't notice any issue, but quotes are heavily styled.
IPB never stores bbcode – instead it converts HTML back to bbcode when a user's goes back to edit their post – then it converts it back to HTML and stores it again. ocPortal can't do that reverse conversion itself for a few reasons.


Become a fan of ocPortal on Facebook or add me as a friend. Add me on on Twitter.
Was I helpful?
  • If not, please let us know how we can do better (please try and propose any bigger ideas in such a way that they are fundable and scalable).
  • If so, please let others know about ocPortal whenever you see the opportunity.
  • If my reply is too Vulcan or expressed too much in business-strategy terms, and not particularly personal, I apologise. As a company & project maintainer, time is very limited to me, so usually when I write a reply I try and make it generic advice to all readers. I'm also naturally a joined-up thinker, so I always express my thoughts in combined business and technical terms. I recognise not everyone likes that, don't let my Vulcan-thinking stop you enjoying ocPortal on fun personal projects.
  • If my response can inspire a community tutorial, that's a great way of giving back to the project as a user.
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Posted
Rating:
#31082
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Community saint

So I am right in it being a bug but by the sound of it one that will not be fixed as it was not created to do such a thing for reasons you have not given yet.
What does Nuances  mean?

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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Posted
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#31084
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Community saint

testing

Needed this to view source.


Last edit: by amichan

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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Posted
Rating:
#31085
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Community saint

locate .comcode_quote_content,
.comcode_code_content
 and add
,
.quotemain
at the end of the last one so it will look like this.
.comcode_quote_content,
.comcode_code_content,
.quotemain


My problem is now fixed by doing the above.

I am once again getting the feeling I need to rewrite every one of your tutorials so every one who uses this system can understand them.
Although I am no dummy and I can not even understand half of them, they are just to complicated like your above one which I simplified. I could walk people though the exact steps I took to get that far.
Basically I used view source both on the testing above and on the quite on my site.


Last edit: by amichan

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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Posted
Rating:
#31086
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Community saint

ok now I know a better way of saying what you said for every one to understand.

Go into IPB's css and locate the css class that generates the quote.
Once you have the class from IPB add it to the quote class for ocportal like this.

The ocPortal class for quotes is
.comcode_quote_content
So locate .comcode_quote_content,
.comcode_code_content
 and add
,
.quotemain (which would be what you found out from the IPB css.)
at the end of the last class in the ocPortal css so it will look like this.
.comcode_quote_content,
.comcode_code_content,
.quotemain

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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Posted
Rating:
#31128
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So I am right in it being a bug

This isn't actually something that would meet our definition of a bug. ocPortal is actually rendering the HTML correctly, but it has no special styling displayed with it. This may be customised in in the ocPortal stylesheets.

for reasons you have not given yet

We'd be able to display the IPB quotes as Comcode quotes if IPB didn't break most of the rules of good database design by storing bad data in their database. Because we can only extract IPB's HTML (not BBCode) out of the database, we have to go with that HTML, rather than our own. We can't take IPB's styling and put it into our global.css because it would be a copyright violation.

What does Nuances  mean?

Subtleties [that must be considered].


Thanks very much for posting your instructions, and I'm sure these would be of some help to users.
I'd also advise changing:

Code

.comcode_quote_h4,
to:

Code

.comcode_quote_h4,.quotetop

However, I'm actually honestly surprised that this worked cleanly. It's a happy coincidence that they're styles almost can be aligned with ours. Therefore I've put a bit of subsitution code into the forum driver, which will be included in the next release; it performs a similar function, but automatically.

I am once again getting the feeling I need to rewrite every one of your tutorials so every one who uses this system can understand them.
Although I am no dummy and I can not even understand half of them, they are just to complicated like your above one which I simplified. I could walk people though the exact steps I took to get that far.

To be perfectly honest, we recommend people use OCF to avoid problems like this. There are always going to be complexities with integrating with other software, especially in situations like this where IPS have made design decisions that break industry standard practices, and are generally bad for compatibility.

There are also other problems. For example, IPB member profiles will not contain a link to the ocPortal points profile of the member being viewed, unless the website staff modify their IPB templates to link to ocPortal stuff. That is unavoidable from our point of view (we're not willing to start distributing IPB modifications), and it means that any classy level of integration between third-party-forum and ocPortal will require a certain level of skill to perform.
We'd rather invest our time in improving OCF than trying to smooth things over. In particular, if we did decide to smooth things over by releasing IPB modifications, we'd find ourselves in a constant loop of re-releasing, every time IPB made an upgrade - it would suck up all our resources.
I appreciate that those who do want to stick with IPB, for whatever reason, are not left in the best position here. However, I am always willing to assist further if I can solve something in a reasonable amount of time. I'd have stepped this through in more detail with you or any other user but it was late by the time this topic was made, and by the time I was back from next day's work you'd already done that. When we finish version 4 we are planning to go through all the forum topics and look for more things to document, but it takes serious time and planning to do that in a structured way, and we don't want to slow down our version 4 development. I'd rather people just ask if they have problems for now.


Become a fan of ocPortal on Facebook or add me as a friend. Add me on on Twitter.
Was I helpful?
  • If not, please let us know how we can do better (please try and propose any bigger ideas in such a way that they are fundable and scalable).
  • If so, please let others know about ocPortal whenever you see the opportunity.
  • If my reply is too Vulcan or expressed too much in business-strategy terms, and not particularly personal, I apologise. As a company & project maintainer, time is very limited to me, so usually when I write a reply I try and make it generic advice to all readers. I'm also naturally a joined-up thinker, so I always express my thoughts in combined business and technical terms. I recognise not everyone likes that, don't let my Vulcan-thinking stop you enjoying ocPortal on fun personal projects.
  • If my response can inspire a community tutorial, that's a great way of giving back to the project as a user.
Back to the top
 
Posted
Rating:
#31133
Avatar

Community saint

Yes I do not like the ocf and I have used it.
Well I do like the PT and whisper system but a few things or reasons why I use IPB are.
I like and use the arcade, I have 3 rpg/mmorpg systems installed (The inferno, battle system, army system), I like the rss import and export, I have not installed it yet but it has a market system which will allow members to buy things like display name changes, title changes and other things, things of which I would love to see in the oportal store.

But yes you are right just do not stop supporting external forums. I remember when mkportal did that and lost some of the staff, which was why they actually changed their minds but it has not been the same because one of the staff they lost gave the must support. How ever that staff works for the smf arcade as well so he has more time for that.

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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Posted
Rating:
#31134
Avatar

Community saint

Also I am sorry about the documention thing I like all the work your doing and all I really wanted was ocPortal to display things correctly. I know you do not have time to make ipb display Ocportal stuff and honestly I would not even expect that.  
I am considered and expert on IPB so I do all that my self and have done a pretty good job of that.
If need be I or my company can have ocPortal mods that link the 2 systetms together better but I want you to work on what you need to work on ( not trying to be bossy just trying to be nice and considerate).

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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Posted
Rating:
#31231
Avatar

Community saint

Chris Graham said

To be perfectly honest, we recommend people use OCF to avoid problems like this. There are always going to be complexities with integrating with other software, especially in situations like this where IPS have made design decisions that break industry standard practices, and are generally bad for compatibility.

There are also other problems. For example, IPB member profiles will not contain a link to the ocPortal points profile of the member being viewed, …..

We'd rather invest our time in improving OCF than trying to smooth things over. In particular, if we did decide to smooth things over by releasing IPB modifications, we'd find ourselves in a constant loop of re-releasing, every time IPB made an upgrade - it would suck up all our resources….. When we finish version 4 we are planning to go through all the forum topics and look for more things to document, but it takes serious time and planning to do that in a structured way, and we don't want to slow down our version 4 development. I'd rather people just ask if they have problems for now.
Yes this is absolutely the correct way to go from our point of view Chris, you cannot drop the ball on the integrated OCF (AND ver 4) which we are kind of getting used to and so are our site members. There are mosat definitely a list of enhancements needed, some more urgent than others and many have been discussed on various forum posts.

We would suggest, at the appropriate time you might want to set up a work list of final suggested features for development review in relation to the OCF and we can all peruse and add constructive comment. You might also want to set up a few of the site "experts" here into a "Beta" group of testers as more hands make light work in this sort of development… Perhaps with enough inputs and testing we could get it to be a world leader in forum technology… Forums are definitely evolving even more and adding things like "click to chat in real time within forums for users on line" etc maybe even one day we will see a small video image screen of who you are chatting to via yr inbuilt webcam … Whatever road you decide to go down one thing is for sure and that is you have a diehard band of dedicated followers…! :thumbs:    

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Posted
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#31238
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Community saint

I agree with that whole thing and I may have mentioned the beta thing to Chris and from what I remember I am part of the beta testing group I think if I am thinking correctly that every one who is a customer is part of that group.
Also I would not want Chris to take a way my job. Its my job to make mods for IPB so it works better with ocPortal and I do not want him to stop supporting any external forums.
I know that ocf is good but it lacks things IPB has, things that would probably get me to loose members if I no longer had.

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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Posted
Rating:
#31255
Avatar

Community saint

amichan said

…Its my job to make mods for IPB so it works better with ocPortal and I do not want him to stop supporting any external forums.I know that ocf is good but it lacks things IPB has, things that would probably get me to loose members if I no longer had.
We have previously discussed the lack of some things but after using OCF for a while there are some things in OCF that I cannot see in IPB such as "History" on changes to "Important Posts", (You can go back to any previous version) The ability to move topics to new topic headings and to new forums I thought was quite well done in OCF.

I am wondering if together we should produce a definitive chart of all the feathures in IPB and OCF in some sort of a priority order. That should give us the must have features for a forum system  and will tell us if OCF has the feature or not.

The main point is that if the community devotes time and expertise to fixing other forums into OC wouldn't that effort be better spent getting OCF features enhanced. There seem to be a lot of "Integration features' in OCF such as whisperss to other members and  private forums with other members that is integrated fully to the user account AND points system. The points system is actually quite interesting and I don't think it is well used. The points system could be used to reward for posts in some forums and not others and some topics perhaps not others. These points could be used for download of some documents that are worth something etc. ALL of this sort of stuff cannot be handled easily in stand alone modules and really only works properly in an integrated way. The security profiling of groups and integrated into forums is pretty strong as well and would have thought would match any other system.

So if the forum is not integrated i.e IPB it would not fully take advantage of and leverage the functionality in OCP. So how do you deal with this? You either say I am going to fix OCF and deliver the features it needs (Good for end user experience) OR you say I will put IPB in OCP and not take advantage of all the OCOP integration (bad for the end user experience)

Its a hard one for you Amichan as you seem to have such an terrific expertise in IPB. We do not, and are becoming committed to OCF and assisting to develop the required features would be a better move for us as we cannot devote any additional time to other than OCP in development as it is all too hard to integrate some other product into other areas we see expanding in the future…  Thats my thoughts on it anyway….
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Posted
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#31257
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Community saint

I did use ocf for a while and do like its PT and whisper functions but that was all I liked about it and even though IPB does not have those I like it better.
I do like your idea of with a definitive chart of features.
I infact posted 2 sugestions I would like to see in ocf.

Also i am not sure what features of ocp that can not be used when using IPB or other forums, besides the ocf features so you have me a bit confused by that one.

I run http://otakuplayground.com and am hopping to make themes and other things for ocportal even though I no longer use it for otakuplayground.com I still love it and feel it could go far with the right help. It needs themes and needs people to advertise for it.
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